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July 04, 2005



I live in Syracuse, and have posted twice so far on the destiny idea.

Let me know what you think...

Thoughts on the Destiny USA R&D Park


Why Syracuse is the Right Place to Weather the Coming Oil Shortage

Tamara  Rogers

We need this opportunity to create jobs for all of those that have lost their jobs due to relocation of big business away from upstate NY. I welcome this project here. Syracuse used to be a top city to raise a family, work and visit. Somewhere along the way, it lost that something that made it what it was, it's time to get that back!!!!


Yeah. Nothing like a mall to make Syracuse seem like something it used to be.


The mall isn't the most important part of the equation. Getting an alternative fuel and sustainable building and development R&D park is the first step to revitalizing the economy of the CNY region. What do you suggest, Walt, re-digging the Erie Canal and mining salt again?

We desperately need high tech jobs in the area to prevent the futher brain drain. We have great colleges and universities in the area, and a population of young adults that wants to live here. But the lack of jobs that pay well is sending people away.


This project is a joke. In order for the project to be feasible, DestiNY will have to draw people from hundreds of miles away. How many "vehicle miles traveled" is that? All those VMT will be made in private automobiles using gasoline. And who will drive 500 miles to go to a mall, no matter how cool it seems, when gas costs $3, $4, $5 per gallon, as it inevitably will before this decade is out? Is Congel going to offer every consumer in the northeastern United States free transportation to DestiNY?

Congel is a lot of things, but he is first and foremost a mall developer. His goal is to make money. If he really wanted to encourage environmental sustainability, he would shut down all of his malls that cover the landscape in asphalt, encourage massive private auto use, and that also perpetuate a consumption driven society that is neither sustainable nor healthy. Then he would take his hundreds of millions of dollars and use them to radically upgrade the rail infrastructure in Syracuse. Finally, he would invest in projects that create real jobs, not mall jobs that pay $6/hour.

This is just another scam being pushed by people and on people who believe two contradictory things: first, that we can continue life as we know it indefinitely despite an imminent shortage of energy and a collapse of our national economy-and second, that we can do it in a sustainable manner.

If there was any liklihood of this project actually being built, I would be frightened, but since I know it won't be, I can just laugh. I'm also happy to note that the people of Syracuse are not placing any hope in this thing to be the silver bullet for the region's economic woes. The only one who will be disappointed in the end will be Congel himself.


Size matters. A large Syracuse mall requires large patronage with attendant transportation and ecology problems. Think small. Visit small English villages. Get uncrowded. Walk and bike more. Talk to your neighbors face to face. The Syracuse mall will be a success only in showing that the bigger they are the harder they fall.

Alex Redrose

I am lost to see such comments on Destiny -- what's wrong with it? It's a challenge which is been accepted by, after all how many of such things have come up in past, why having a myopic view?

It's one of the best projects I have ever heard off and await to see it in practical.

By heart and by soul I support this project,and also willing to invest my 90% of my life savings if an oppertunity is given. (10% of my savings are left for any other project like this anywhere in the world.)

Kindly sound me when any investment oppertunity is there.



I live in Pennsylvania, about 2 or 3 hrs from Syracuse. I welcome the idea of this Mega green project for the area. We need all businesses and corporations to get involved with using reusable energy. Set the example for others to follow. Look at the experimental Walmarts out west running on biofuels. It shouldn't take this long to get corporations to wake up and realize that we can't just keep drying the earth of non reusable fuels. We all need to do our part and recycle, start using biofuels etc.. I just bought my 1st home and looking to convert to using biofuel. (pellet furnace as a start)
As far as the previous comments about causing more emissions due to people driving to get to this mall? Well first of all, with the cost of gas these days, I would prefer to drive the 2-3 hrs to Syracuse for a mini vacation at Destiny USA, rather then the cost to drive the 19 hrs to Orlando for 1 week. People are going to take vacations regardless. If you give them a closer destination for their getaway, actually you are helping the environment by using less gasoline. You say people from around the world will come to this DestinyUSA, causing more travel? Well aren't those people going to travel anyway? Where you take your vacation is a matter of choice. If it's not Syracuse, it may be skiing in VT., Disney World, Washington DC., Atlantic City, Vegas, California etc.. People who travel across the globe for their vacation are going to go regardless of whether it's to this megamall-resort or another destination...

As for those people who are serious shoppers, they'll travel hrs to NYC, Philadelphia or to the factory outlets, so what's the difference in going to Syracuse. Actually Syracuse is closer for a lot of people then big cities like Philadelphia, NYC etc.. Another point is that hopefully this project will even boost the Broome county area. Real estate is hurting in the Binghamton area. My sister wanted to put her home on the market up there, however the market is so bad for sellers in there compared to the national market which is a seller's market. Everyone's moving out in her town, due to the lack of jobs. The college grads go elsewhere. As an adult I have only been to Syracuse once 7 that was to visit the Carousel mall. I usually go to the Philadelphia King of Prussia Mall or to the outlets in Lancaster, PA. which is the same or even more of a distance for me.

Mike F

The green aspect is truly a joke, for the reasons mentioned by previous posters. It is a way for Congel to try to get free government money. As an engineer with a real concern for efficiency and sustainability, this kind of abuse upsets me. If you review the history (not hard to do--go to wikipedia), you see that this project has been a thinly concealed grab at taxpayer money through aggressive abuse of political connections on the state and local level. At the initial "groundbreaking," the developer had no completed construction plans. Currently (Summer '06), the developer is trying to push through a deal that would give them massive tax breaks with no guarantee of construction to the city.

Green? As long as you give them the money up front, I'm sure the developer would call himself a treehugger.


I work in Chile SOUTH AMERICA there are a lot of opportunities in biomass energy I want to take contact with equipment suppliers companies in this area , now there are 8 proyects in this area promotes by the state of Chile , so please if you can help me ,send me details how can I contact with this companies.

Chris N

In case anyone is still reading these posts, the projecy is a go. Financing has been secured and bonds have been sold, including Green Bonds. Construction on phase 1 WILL begin this month.


Well, they have been building for about a month now and are using 100% bio fule for the construction. So far they are sticking to what they said.

Ken  M

Been to the Carousel Mall in August and looks like phase one is under way. Keep in mind that this really is not the start of DestinyUSA. Phase one is just expansion to the Carousel Mall. I found the projected number of days to completion odd. Dividing it out it lookslike 10 years..... That sounds off.

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